"The Parent First Approach" with Kyle Wester

In this podcast episode, Ric Shields, the host and director of the DoorWays® Ministry Network, speaks with Kyle Wester, a counselor who specializes in helping both adults and children navigate life's challenges. Kyle emphasizes a parent-first approach to therapy, advocating that parents are the best equipped to help their children by first addressing their own behaviors and interactions. He shares insights on the importance of maintaining open communication and building strong, connected relationships with children from an early age. Kyle also discusses the concept of "open and closed doors" as a metaphor for the state of relationships and communication within families. He highlights the significance of parents being vulnerable and open to foster trust and cooperation with their children.

The episode concludes with practical advice for parents to focus on the positive attributes of their children and to engage in activities that strengthen their bond. Kyle's approach aims to transform family dynamics, making parenting a journey of mutual growth and understanding.

Transcript

TOPIC: The Parent-First Approach
GUEST: Kyle Wester, LPC
Season 4, Episode 5

Kyle Wester (00:00):

The dad did something really cool. He looked at her and he said, "You know, honey, I can do that sometimes. Sometimes I like to win and I like to be right, and that's probably why you're feeling this way, but I want you to know, I don't think you're broken. I don't think you're messed up. I just want to love you the way you are."

(00:17):

And that all of a sudden gave the daughter the permission to say, "It's safe to be vulnerable with you, Dad." And that's when she started to cry. They hugged and I was like, "Dang, that was awesome!"

Ric Shields (00:38):

Thank you for joining us on this podcast. I'm Ric Shields, your host and the director of the DoorWays® Ministry Network. I'm talking today with Kyle Wester, a friend who helps people to successfully navigate challenges in their lives. He works with both adults and children, providing them with the tools they need to overcome difficulties and obstacles, and to put them on a path of living lives of significance with lasting impact on the relationships in communities where they live. So, thank you Kyle, for joining me today.

Kyle Wester (01:06):

Thank you so much, Ric, for having me on. Looking forward to it.

Ric Shields (01:09):

Hey, take a minute, Kyle, and tell me what you're doing these days in terms of work or ministry. How do you look at that?

Kyle Wester (01:16):

Yeah, man. So, the, the thing that both my wife and I are very passionate about, Ric, is changing the conversation around parenting. You know, I think for a long time, a lot of parents had a kind of limited imagination of what it could look like to raise healthy kids that are self-disciplined, respectful, kind, but also courageous. And as we learned more and more about what that could look like and how that could be done, we just couldn't leave it alone. <Laugh>.

(01:46):

So, what we've done is have the private practice where at the private practice you know, we've been doing that for over 10 years now. We help with all types of things. Like, you know, kids come in at all times with all types of problems. But the unique thing that we do, that we're passionate about is, there's a lot of therapy places in Tulsa and a lot of therapy places around the world, right?

(02:03):

But the thing that we do that's unique is when a parent calls us up and says, "Hey, I would like to get help for my kid. My kid's having some anxiety or depression, or whatever it might be. I'd like to get them to come in."

(02:13):

Now, lots of therapy practices, not all of them, Ric, but lots of them will say, "Cool, let's set up a time for your kid." Well, I'm not going to do that. Like, I really think the best person to help that kid is the parents. I think that we can do great work and I think we can really equip that kid and encourage that kid. But any good work we do with that kid means nothing if we're not helping change how the parents are interacting with that kid and addressing these conflicts.

Ric Shields (02:38):

That's where it all starts anyway, isn't it?

Kyle Wester (02:40):

100%. And so, it's more of what I would call a parent-first approach of, I think if I can equip that parent, encourage that parent give them the skills, then that parent can not only give it to that kid, but to every kid in that family, right? And then I see it that the, the whole switch there is flipped. I don't think this kid's problems are anything more than a catalyst for change within that family. And so, then that kid, their issues become a blessing of sorts to cause us to like to reflect and go, "What are we doing and how could we do it differently?" So that, that's what,

Ric Shields (03:15):

That seems to be exactly opposite of what I often hear. I often hear what you've already alluded to.

Kyle Wester (03:20):

Yeah.

Ric Shields (03:21):

That yeah, we can help the kid, but if we don't help the parent. And so, you really have flipped the switch on this. How you decide to do that?

Kyle Wester (03:27):

Well, once I realized where the power was, right? And, and I started to see how this dynamic and therapy in particular was, it was kind of messed up because, you know, I would see kids who were getting therapy at school. Sometimes the therapist is never even meeting with the parents, which is mind blowing to me. But then also just parents would come to me and say, "Yeah, I've only talked to the therapist once. I don't even know what they're doing with my kid."

(03:50):

And I just, I'm like, that makes no sense to me. <Laugh>. It's like the very person who has the power to change this is the adult. And if I buy into this like philosophy or this kind of perspective that somehow the kid is broken and needs to be fixed, I think that's at the core of the problem. I think the kid is just a result of what's been happening in the home, both good and bad. And we need to figure out how to shift that.

(04:18):

And the kid, Ric, is saying, "How did I start that?" The kid would be saying that the kid would be like, "I'm glad you're meeting with me, <laugh>, but I really wish you'd help my parents. You know, their marriage is falling apart. They're constantly yelling at me. They seem depressed themselves."

Ric Shields (04:34):

Yeah. The kids are just acting out what they're seeing at home.

Kyle Wester (04:36):

100%. Yes. Well, there's a great book on this by Archbishop Desmond Tutu. And, you know, he's the guy who helped Nelson Mandela in South Africa. And it's called 'Made for Goodness.' And he talks about in there about how he's like, these, these white kids in South Africa, they weren't raised racist. You know, they were taught how to be that way. And so that's where him and Nelson were very passionate about reaching across the aisle to get to know these people. And they believed these kids wanted unity. They wanted love between races. They didn't want to hate each other, but they were, it was modeled to them, and they were taught and trained how to be that way.

Ric Shields (05:14):

Kyle, it's been said that having a teenager in your home helps you understand why it is that some animal species eat their young. Now, is there a primary issue in this parent-child relationship that seems to bring that conflict? And I, you know, you're looking at me like, “Ric, I can't believe you said that,” but I did.

Kyle Wester (05:31):

No, I read that when you sent the notes and I was laughing. It's hilarious because I'm sure a lot of parents feel that way. I would flip the paradigm. I think the teenage years should be and can be the most exciting time in your parenting journey. And here's why. It's the time when finally, you get to see them blossom. You get to see them like on this journey of exploration over who they are and how they're going to, and if you want to tie in faith into that, like who God is calling them to be, and you get to be like, instead of you being there just as like a, an observer, you get to be an active participant hand in hand with that kid on that journey.

(06:10):

But I think the reason why it's so scary is because one, there's, there's a lot on the line, right? Like the stakes really go up in those teenage years. But two, I think if we, in those early years, haven't practiced doing it hand in hand with them. We've just been dragging them along, <laugh> or we've completely disconnected to them over those early years. Then the teenage years are scary because that actually is the time when they need you so desperately. And they want you so desperately, they want you to be with them on that journey. And they're sitting there making these huge choices about their life and about what they're going to do with it. And they're just alone. And so, I want parents to be coming to those teenage years saying like, "This is exciting. I'm excited about these years, but I've got to be intentional about those early years on forming a connected relationship where we are co-creating this life together."

Ric Shields (07:08):

I think those early years are really important. We hear so many parents talk about the terrible two's. And we decided early on we were not going to call them the terrible two's. They were going to be the terrific twos.

(07:18):

And you know what? We really enjoyed our kids at two years old. Three years old. And as teenagers. But part of it is a mindset on behalf of the parents, too. How are we going to view this? And if we start viewing it negatively, you think we're going to be able to end up not viewing it negatively? We won't.

Kyle Wester (07:37):

Well, what, and Ric, the science backs that up. Like in neuroscience, there's a common you know, quote of "what you focus on, you get more of." You know, so if I'm focusing on the terrible two's, I'm going to see all of the normal developmental things twos do, which is sometimes they tell you no, and that's good <laugh>. Like, sometimes they tell you, "I don't want to do that." That's how they find out who they are. Right? But you're going to see that in a negative spin. And as soon as you do that, you're going to start to get afraid. And as soon as you get afraid, you're going to start to control.

(08:09):

You know, I remember a really perfect example of this that I think ties perfectly into the teenage years because this is kind of where it shifted for me. I remember I'm downtown Tulsa. We'd just gone out to eat. I had my oldest was three. My middle was maybe like six months old, somewhere in there. We're leaving to, to go out into the busy downtown traffic. And I'm holding my son in my arms, and he has peed on me. <Laugh>, right? He's like, diaper is wet, right? It's on my shirt. It's disgusting. I grabbed my daughter's hand and said to her, "Hold my hand."

(08:40):

And up until then, Ric, she had always been super cooperative with holding my hand. But for whatever reason, probably tired, it had been a long day. Whatever. Maybe she felt my stress and anxiety about the situation. She pulls away from me. So, what do you think I do? Well, I, I grab harder, right? I grip her hand with more strength. Well, what do you think she does? She does what almost any human would do; she pulls back harder, right?

(09:02):

So now we're in this power struggle, this tug of war. So now I'm like, "Uh-uh, this ain't happening." I pick her up and I now get a hold of her and she starts to kick and hit. Because that's what people do when they're afraid. They try to control and grab and subdue. And I was teaching her that I will use fear to dominate you in this moment.

(09:25):

And when we got in the car, I could see, like, I was really mad. She could feel the break in connection. And I could see her start to get kind of scared. Like she was a little like, "oh no, dad's really mad." Right? And it took me a long time to really calm down from this. Not because I was necessarily mad at her, because I was so scared that this was going to be a new norm. But that's when the light bulb hit me. I've never taught her how to do traffic downtown. <Laugh>. I've never taught her how dangerous it can be downtown. Right? How would she know that she could die? Because she doesn't know this, right?

(09:59):

So that's when I thought, oh, oh, it hit me. You know? And I’ve heard this a lot. The root word of discipline is disciple. How do I disciple in this moment? Well, here's what I did, Ric, and this is an example of what I would do with her now when she's 15, is I went outside and I said, "Hey Abby, do you want to go play?" And she said, "Yeah." And she ran across the street because there was a play area across from our house. And I just stood there. I didn't go over there. And she said, "Dad, come over here." And I said, “Honey, I'm not going over there until we'll safe. Okay? I want to walk together."

(10:28):

And she was mad. She yelled at me and screamed at me. And I said, "Honey, I want to play with you too, but I'm not doing it until we're safe." So, she, reluctantly at first, came over there, fine, <laugh>, and she put her hand out. I grabbed her hand, I said, "Thank you for being safe." And we walked across the street and I thought, "That is discipleship." Right?

(10:47):

And then from then on, I've never had that problem with the other two kids because Abby became my safe person. Abby would say to the kids, 'Hey guys, let's all grab hands, we're walking across the street. Hey, let's hold hands we're going across." Because she realized I was trying to love her, but I was using fear to control her instead.

Ric Shields (11:07):

So, what you're telling me is that sometimes you've had to navigate conflicts in your home with your kids. How, and you're talking about how you were, well, you weren't really proactive, you reacted to this. But how can you be proactive in it?

Kyle Wester (11:21):

I think if we're talking to parents about teenagers, if you'll notice what I did in that, the way I was reactive at first, and that's how most of these conflicts will start, right? And this is what I love about parenting, why I'm so passionate. Lots of times these, these kids like catch you off guard, <laugh>. You know, like, you're like, “I never expected this to happen. I never expected me to react that way.”

(11:41):

And so, this whole goal in parenting, I hope your listeners hear this, it isn't about doing it perfectly. It's the same kind of like your walk with God. God isn't expecting you to do it perfect. It's really about what I do when I mess up, when I'm being the human I don't want to be. When I'm reacting in a way I don't want to react. Right?

(11:59):

So, what I did was, that night I prayed about it, I talked about it with Sarah, we had a plan, and the next day I thought, how can I teach Abby to trust me when it comes to walking across the street? How do I get that connection to where she's cooperative and we then co-create what it looks like to be safe walking across the street.

(12:18):

And that is like a go-to simple base model of it always begins with the relationship and connection. If I have a lot of money in the bank, I'm in the black with my kids, you're going to see cooperation receptiveness, openness, all of that's going to happen more easily. If I'm in the red, how do I know I'm there? I'm seeing them closed off. I'm seeing them pull away because they don't trust that what you're trying to do and how you're trying to disciple them is going to be helpful. They think you're just against them. It's just going to be another lesson on how they're a bad kid and they're wrong and you're right.

Ric Shields (12:53):

You've got to keep making those deposits. You really do.

Kyle Wester (12:56):

And it happens all day long. You can take money from the bank all day long, or you can keep deposit. It could be as simple as going by and like in the morning, Ric, we, I'm sure you did this with your kids, every morning starts with, "Hey, good morning. It's so good to see you." And I give them a hug and just like, "Hey, how'd you sleep last night?" Right? Just like a simple conversation like that. Like I am genuinely excited to see them and they can feel that.

Ric Shields (13:17):

I began to learn as the, and I had to learn because nobody taught me. You know, I'd like to go in the morning, flip on the lights, "Wake up! Time to get up!" you know, "blah, blah, blah, let's go!" And oh, my word, it didn't go very well. And then I began to realize nobody does that to me. I mean, my alarm goes off, I turn over, I hit it a couple of times. And so, I started going to the room, opening the door and saying, "Hey guys, you need to wake up. I'll give you about five minutes. I'll come back in again." And it made all the difference in how the day started. It's crazy.

Kyle Wester (13:49):

But Ric, you did a simple trick there that a lot of parents don't take time to do. Which is a lot of time if parents are being honest with themselves, they're treating their kids the way they believe their kids are treating them, instead of taking a moment and saying, "I'm going to treat them the way I'd like to be treated. I'm going to do to them what I'd want them to do to me." Right. And if I don't do that, then I end up letting the kids dictate the human being I'm going to be. Like, what you did there is you said, "Gow do I like to be treated in the morning? How do I like to treat myself? Okay. Yeah. I give myself a little time." I'm kind of patient. I don't, I don't, I would hate it if, if my wife came in there and like started yelling, "get up! I'm tired of telling you, Ric." Like, you would not like that.

Ric Shields (14:29):

Yeah. How well would that go?

Kyle Wester (14:31):

And that's something unique that we do a lot in the coaching that we do. Ric, is I'll say to dads and moms, like, "That thing you just did, if you did that in your marriage, do you think it would work?" And they would say, "Well, no, it wouldn't. I would actually really be really resentful if they did that."

(14:47):

"Then why are you doing it with them? Don't you want to raise kids who know how to have successful adult relationships?"

Ric Shields (14:54):

Yeah, it's all about relationships.

Kyle Wester (14:56):

Yeah. You start by giving them those skills right now. So, I do that a lot. If I'm confused by how to handle a situation with one of my kids, I think, "Okay, if Sarah and I had a similar conflict, how would I do that? Or if God and I had a similar conflict, how would God handle that?" And that was a real game changer. I realized like, "Oh, I never have. God, he doesn't seem to ever yell at me <laugh>." He doesn't ever seem to, when I come to him, when I am scared, maybe I've messed up. He seems to make it a priority to help me feel safe with him. And then he's like, "Hey, let me show you a better way to do that."

(15:27):

And so, I thought, that's what I want in my marriage. That's what I want my relationship with God. I want my kids to experience that same type of relationship.

Ric Shields (15:34):

Not to say I know everything about parenting. You've been a good friend of my son, Travis, since you were in elementary school. I'm pretty sure he told you times that I just absolutely drove him crazy.

Kyle Wester (15:47):

I'm sure.

Ric Shields (15:47):

But I thank God we still have a wonderful relationship today.

Kyle Wester (15:50):

Yes.

Ric Shields (15:51):

You're listening to the DoorWays® Ministry Network podcast. My name is Ric Shields. I joined this episode with Kyle Wester who works with adults and their children, providing them with the tools they need to overcome difficulties and obstacles and put them on a path of living lives of significance with lasting impact in the relationships that they have and in their communities.

(16:12):

I should mention that he also has a great podcast, he and his wife Sara. It's called "Art of Raising Humans" with weekly episodes. They also have a blog and additional resources on their website. That is artofraisinghumans.com. You can also schedule appointments with them if you or if your family need the help of a licensed counselor.

(16:33):

Kyle, when we spoke last week in preparation for this podcast, you were telling me about doors. Open doors and closed doors, and how they relate to communication with your teenager. Can you share a little bit about that with our listeners today?

Kyle Wester (16:47):

Yes. Well, I came up with this metaphor about three or four years ago to kind of help explain to kids, especially teenagers and parents kind of what I see happening in relationships. And also, kind of demystify things like anxiety and depression and, and even how to repair relationships.

(17:01):

So, what I noticed, I'd gone to this conference, Ric, where this guy was sharing some research. And the research was this; that kids, by the time they're in first grade, report that 90% of kids like who they are. And I thought, that's interesting. Like, I've noticed that kids who are in first grade are super easy to connect with and they're super easy to play with. If you just like get on the ground and play with them, and you do something, they're all, you're their friend. It’s super easy. And they really don't care what your race is. Your gender is. Your religion is. They're like, "Hey, cool. You're, you're my friend because we played together."

(17:32):

And I thought that that's interesting. That makes me think of like when, when kids are first born, if I had this metaphor of a door, like the door is wide open when that kid's born. Well, what does that mean? The door's open? Well, love flows freely from them to you and from you to them. Babies are super easy to love. And they’re super easy to receive, they're so loving.

(17:53):

And then by first grade, I'm like, yeah, you really, that hasn't changed a lot. Like I remember even when I was a jerk to my kids in those early years where I would've yelled at them and treated them in ways I would not want them to treat me. They would come back and they would forgive me so quickly and they'd want to hug me within minutes. And I almost like struggled with wanting to hug them back. And I'm like, "What is the deal here? Why is their door so open still? Why is mine closed?"

(18:16):

And this research thing went on to say, by fifth grade, 50% of kids reported liking who they were. And then by high school, by the time they graduated, 90% said they didn't. Right. So, you're seeing this decrease in the kids reporting positive feelings about themselves.

(18:34):

And I thought, what is happening? What has gone on? And when I would talk to teenagers, teenagers would say, “Well, man, in the elementary years, that's easy. Like all of a sudden you realize like, people don't like you. You start getting rejected by friends, teachers start getting mad at you, or parents start getting upset. Coaches are yelling at you.”

(18:49):

So, like, oh, oh, that's interesting. So, it's like you start to close the door because you feel like you're going to be rejected, right? You, you're going to get, like people are going to say in some sense, you're not good enough. You know, you, you're not worthy of love as you are. And then by the time they go in those teenage years, they've had so many experiences that back that up, you'll find teenagers literally are closing the door. Like they're coming home and they're just closing the door. And they will say, “I do that because if my parents open it, they're going to talk to me about how dirty my room is, how I haven't got homework done. It's going to be criticism, judgment, nitpicking. I'd rather just have the door closed.”

(19:22):

But that's the problem. Once the door's closed, now all of these big decisions that the kids are facing, like about where am I going to go to college? How do I get good grades in this class? How do I deal with this friend? Now they're completely isolated and alone, and they have no way of accessing the very help and love that's on the other side of the door. So, in an attempt to be safe, they've also isolated themselves.

(19:47):

But one little kind of key thing there, Ric, is I find the parents have done the exact same thing. As the kid is pulled away, as the kid has seemingly rejected them in a lot of different ways, the parent is filled with shame. The parent is thinking, “I have failed them. Like, they don't want to even spend time with me.” And so they've closed the door too to be safe from all those feelings of rejection.

(20:09):

And so that's why the parent first approach is so vital. Because if I'm going to ask that kid to open his door, I want you to open yours, man. Like, I want that parent to take the risk that even if they say, "I don't want to hang out tonight," maybe I go up and just say, "Hey, how's it going in here?" And it's not to like criticize them. It's not to like to tell them they need to do this better, that better. It really is just to see them in a different way. See them the way Jesus sees them. You know?

(20:36):

So, that metaphor what I think just to demystify therapy is I think the whole way I help kids who are anxious and depressed is it's my job as the therapist to have my door open to believe that I am worthy of love. I don't need to perform for them. I don't need to be a perfect human being. I just want to be there for them. And I want to show them it's safe to open their door. But in the process of helping the kid do that, I also need to help the parent do that. Because I think it's ridiculous to ask that kid to risk first. I think the parent needs to be the one modeling the vulnerability.

(21:12):

And so, I'll ask parents, a way I would ask them to do that is I would ask them to start by writing five things down that they love about their kid. Five things that maybe they've forgotten in all this conflict with their teenager. Maybe they need to stop and pray for a minute and ask Jesus even to like, how do you see my son or daughter? I want them to write those five things down and I want them to 30 days, make a commitment to look at those five things daily for about a minute. And just let those things seep into their heart that this is who their kid is. And if you start to do that, the kid will feel your door start to open a little bit. They'll feel like maybe it's safe to let you see inside their world and that you won't reject them because they're not perfect.

Ric Shields (21:55):

Kyle, I'm pretty confident you have some success stories. Think of one. What comes, think of one that comes to your mind right off the bat.

Kyle Wester (22:01):

Oh yeah, I love it. No, this one's huge. And when you ask me that, this is one of my early ones where I thought, "Yes, I love this work," <laugh>, because I had this daughter. This was a Christian family too where this daughter and her father and mother were just constantly battling every night. It was a battle with a phone. It was about like, I mean, it was turning into, they were cussing at each other. Screaming at it was, it was just horrible, right? And then at some point, dad went to counseling himself. He bought into this idea of like, I want you to get healthy. Like, stop asking her to just do it. Like you, what you're doing, you, you have power to change.

(22:35):

So, he starts to learn about ADD. So at this point, he's learned what it meant to have ADD and he realized like, “I think my daughter has ADD,” right? And so all of a sudden this like new awareness and understanding of what, what might be underlying some of his daughter's difficulties. He grew in compassion.

(22:52):

And so, he says to me, "Hey, I want to meet with my daughter in a session with you, and I want to talk to her. I want to repair this broken relationship." So, she was very reluctant, Ric. She did not want to go in and talk to her dad. But I said, "Listen, trust me. I think your dad's in a good place. I think this is going to work." So, she said, “Okay, okay.” She was very nervous, but she goes in and dad opens up, "Hey, I've learned about this. I believe it's something you're struggling with.

(23:16):

I want to tell you I'm sorry for how I have been so judgmental and critical of you and that I have just, you know," and he starts to like really pour out his heart. It was really beautiful.

(23:24):

And I'm just sitting there like, this is so awesome. Like, well, how cool is this? But then the daughter, I look at her face, she does, she's not buying it. Like she looks at him and she said something that surprised me. She said, "Oh, so now you know why I'm messed up. Now you have proof that I'm broken. And so yeah, you were right all along. I am broken and messed up." And like, I was like, "Dang, I did not like."

(23:47):

And then, but the dad did something really cool. He looked at her and he said, "You know, honey, that I can do that sometimes. Sometimes I like to win and I like to be right, and that's probably why you're feeling this way, but I want you to know, I don't think you're broken. I don't think you're messed up. I just want to love you the way you are."

(24:05):

And all of a sudden, the tears in her eyes started to flow <laugh>. And it was like, you could see she was holding her door, Ric. It was like dad had opened his door, but she was like, "I'm not opening it. I'm not opening it." But then, so what she did, she kind of slammed it shut. But what dad did was so cool. He didn't go, “Well, fine, I tried.” And then he could have just slammed his door back, right? Instead, he kept his door open and continued to remain vulnerable. And that all of a sudden gave the daughter the permission to say, it's safe to be vulnerable with you dad. And that's when she started to cry. They hugged. And I was like, "Dang, that was awesome, <laugh>. I was like, that was healing."

Ric Shields (24:42):

I would really like to say, I don't have anyone that I know of that I can refer to you. But the truth is I've got so many people I could refer to you, Kyle.

Kyle Wester (24:51):

Well, we love it. We love to, like if I, one last thing I'd like to share. I tell especially I tell parents this all the time. Ric, when I was a little kid, my parents, there's so many things they did that, that was good, but there's a lot of things they did that were just kind of messed up. And they were just doing the best they could. And they didn't know a better way to do it.

(25:09):

But at like 10 or 11, Ric, I could watch things my dad was doing and be like, “Why do you do it that way? Like, that's, it's not going to work, dad. If you do that, we're just going to resent you or you do that.” Like, and I wanted so badly I would go to church and I pray for somebody to come and help my dad.

(25:25):

And I don't think my dad at that time would've been able to even receive that help if it came. And so I feel like part of the work I get to do as a parent coach is I actually get to be that answer to prayer for some little kid, praying for his mom and dad and saying, "Please, God, bring somebody along to help my parents know how to love me the way they always intended to without fear, without shame being these guiding forces."

(25:50):

And so, I just, it's really, really cool when I get to be that answer to prayer for some little kid. And their whole family system changes and the parent's imagination is changed on how they could imagine raising this little kid and really co-creating a relationship that they want with that child.

Ric Shields (26:07):

So, let's put this all together. Let's say you had some words of encouragement that you wanted to summarize all this, put it on a little platter, and pass it off and say, "Do this. Here's something that will help." Summarize that. What would it be?

Kyle Wester (26:24):

Two things. One is I want all the parents to know you're exactly the parent, that that kid needs you. I know you've doubted it. I know you've questioned it. I know you're filled with shame about ways you have failed and messed things up at times. But you are exactly the parent that kid needs in their life. They need you, they want you.

(26:44):

The second thing is this. I have interviewed hundreds and hundreds of teenagers and I'm always surprised that one of the number one things they say they want their parents to know is they actually want to spend time with you. They actually want to connect with you. They actually want to know you and be known by you, but they just don't always want to do it your way. You know, they actually want you to be open to doing things they want to do and connect with them in ways they want to do.

(27:09):

So, if you are willing to do that activity, writing five things down that you love about your kid, spending 30 days meditating on that, wiring your brain to see them as enough, like your kid is enough. They do not need to change to be loved by you or God. They are enough. And once you can see them differently, that's going to help the kid be more receptive and open to trust you and believe that connecting with you is going to be helpful.

Ric Shields (27:39):

I'm a parent and a former youth pastor, and I used to tell people that the word "discipline" had more to do about our parenting style than it did about how we punished our children. And when you realize the word "disciple" is the root of the word "discipline," it adds an entirely new dimension.

(28:00):

If we spent more time discipling our kids, teaching them, explaining to them, revealing our hearts to them, showing them and nurturing them, we'd spend a lot less time disciplining them.

(28:14):

And how interesting for Kyle Wester to tell us that adolescents often say to him, "I wish you would help my parents. Their marriage is broken. They're constantly yelling, they seem depressed."

(28:27):

Perhaps before we try to find help for others, we should start by taking a good look at ourselves. And once we do that, it may surprise us to see how life all around can look so very, very different.

(28:45):

I'm glad you joined us today, and hope you'll be with us again next week as we continue to discuss "Mental Health from the Inside Out." Until then, grace and peace to you and to those you love.